I was waiting to post about Penguicon before the current uproar because I have sworn to dedicate myself to BLOODHOUND and nothing but this week. I am going to finish it if it kills me. But then came the Open Source BP uproar. I think people are probably wondering why it's taken me so long to say anything (for one thing, I only heard about it yesterday--yes, I've actually been working), given that I was one of the Guests of Honor, so I am going to grab a half hour now to talk about Penguicon and that.
Before I say anything else: I had a wonderful time at Penguicon. I was treated like a goddess. I met many wonderful, intelligent, cool fans and many more wonderful, intelligent, cool, creative people. I got to meet my absolute favorite webcomic writer/artist, Jennie Breeden (how favorite? we both squeed and fangirled for five minutes when we met--she's a fan of mine--and had dinner and lunch and got photos taken and made arrangements to meet at DragonCon) and the very excellent writer Cherie Priest, and got to see the wonderful
matociquala, writer Elizabeth Bear. I spoke all too briefly to Jim Hines (whose Goblin War books are popular with teens as well as adults), and then never saw him again, which tells you how mad the con was! I also met writer Sarah Monette, Matthew Keaton, and met writer John Scalzi for the second time, all with excellent results in the brain stimulation and panel discussions department.
I had the best baked goods (baking goddess Deb) and fudge (fudge goddess Kimba) I've had in years. Tim geeked out until he had no words. Or rather, the ones he kept trying to force on me didn't sound like English. I stood fascinated by the Chaos Device for at least 15 minutes as the young man working on it showed me the level of it that he was maintaining (he was about four feet tall, so he had his limits, but he knew how all the parts worked). And I met many strong, intelligent, creative, passionate, geeky, amazing young women.
I saw no one grabbing their breasts. I didn't even hear of this until yesterday. It wasn't an occasion where people were running around grabbing women's breasts. Neither Tim nor I saw or heard of any such behavior. It was limited to a small group, a tiny percentage of the con. I understand the group has since shut down their . . . social experiment.
So here is the post that blew the whole thing open on the Internet (the original is below the updates).
tekanji supplies this list of links to discussions:
Badgerbag's comments
the-red-shoes
Sinboy
coffeeandink
littlebutfierce
peaseblossom
ktempest
jfpbookworm
Feminist SF
James Nicoll
Cynthia1960
cynthia1960
springheel-jack
springheel-jack
springheel-jack
brown-betty
misia
petronelle
odditycollector
pleonastic
fengi
fengi
drownedinink
coffeeandink (Different post than linked above)
kate-nepevu
nihilistic-kid
upstart-crow
hahathor
cjouchan
cereta
nestra
scalzi
kadymae
vito-excalibur
jim-smith
cyberpilate
jarodrussell
kadymae
Getofftheinternet.org
vito-excaliibur
coffeeandink
troubleinchina
coffeeandink
brown-betty
Metafilter.com
awelkin
sparkymonster
sinboy
Girl-Wonder.org
The Iris Network
synedochic
--------------------
edited to add synedochic
--------------------
These include other people's reactions and points. If you look at the comments to those links, you'll find still more reactions. As you can see, a lot of feminists are scorching mad, and I can't blame them.
Here's my take. This is something embarked upon by consenting adults. Fine. Although contrary to the ferret's claim that no one was approached randomly in the halls, he himself writes of the woman in the princess outfit who they approached. The women who did this agreed to it, and John Scalzi writes that the woman who first told him about it was a participant and found it wonderful. I'm frankly envious that she is so free within her skin.
But.
I have spent most of my life in the fight to be perceived as a person, not a collection of body parts. "Biology is not destiny" is very important to me for a number of reasons. To read of women offering up their breasts to be fondled like fruit makes me crazy. That's my issue, obviously, not theirs, but it's something a lot of women and men will be thinking about when they observe this behavior, which is taking place in public. I want to ask these women, what message are you sending? You think you are sending the message, I am free in my body; I am proud of my body, but is that the message that people receive?
Most people won't know about the significance of red and green buttons; they will only see people groping other people, in public. Those who see this will be tense, wondering if they will be approached next. They will not feel safe in a space that the con organizers want them to feel safe in. Women who want to have fun and wear the costumes of their superheroes or anime characters will not feel safe. No matter how many times they tell themselves that clothing is not an advertisement for sexual contact, social brainwashing whispers "you're asking for it." They will choose either not to costume, or not to attend a con where they will not feel safe. Their enjoyment and their sense of safety will be destroyed. The con will be hurt when attendance drops, a serious thing when gas and flight prices make congoing more difficult.
Think on: this social experiment can go bad very quickly. All it takes is one woman who thought she'd try it and then feels violated, not liberated, or one man who decides that breast gropage means yes to further gropage. All it takes is outsiders who witness and report it to hotel management, or fans who don't know what's going on to blast what they've seen all over the internet as a SexCon. All it takes is one he said/she said, or worst of all, one rape. One misunderstanding, one person who thinks because the limits are lifted a little, it means they're lifted all the way.
Why was this not done behind closed doors? Why was it done publicly? I don't want to see other women making this kind of choice. To them it's freedom; to me it looks like they are allowing themselves to be treated as objects. Yes, in their own minds they are free, but do they know what is in the minds of those who fondle them, and those who see them fondled? By keeping it private, they have more control over those fondling them being the kind of person who perceives them as free and giving (maybe). But in public they lend themselves to others' perception of women as collections of parts to be handled. Even if they carried big, informative signs or gave PowerPoint demonstrations about their understanding of what they did, they cannot govern the views of others. They perpetuate a perception of women as sex toys, without even meaning to. I wish they had limited the damage.
I had a WONDERFUL time at Penguicon 6. How many people will remember that as the con of the two singing Tesla coils, and the comics artists drawing all over that guy's skull, and the Tron guy and the Ox delivering goodies from Acme? Or will they remember it as the con where guys were grabbing girls' tits?
Before I say anything else: I had a wonderful time at Penguicon. I was treated like a goddess. I met many wonderful, intelligent, cool fans and many more wonderful, intelligent, cool, creative people. I got to meet my absolute favorite webcomic writer/artist, Jennie Breeden (how favorite? we both squeed and fangirled for five minutes when we met--she's a fan of mine--and had dinner and lunch and got photos taken and made arrangements to meet at DragonCon) and the very excellent writer Cherie Priest, and got to see the wonderful
I had the best baked goods (baking goddess Deb) and fudge (fudge goddess Kimba) I've had in years. Tim geeked out until he had no words. Or rather, the ones he kept trying to force on me didn't sound like English. I stood fascinated by the Chaos Device for at least 15 minutes as the young man working on it showed me the level of it that he was maintaining (he was about four feet tall, so he had his limits, but he knew how all the parts worked). And I met many strong, intelligent, creative, passionate, geeky, amazing young women.
I saw no one grabbing their breasts. I didn't even hear of this until yesterday. It wasn't an occasion where people were running around grabbing women's breasts. Neither Tim nor I saw or heard of any such behavior. It was limited to a small group, a tiny percentage of the con. I understand the group has since shut down their . . . social experiment.
So here is the post that blew the whole thing open on the Internet (the original is below the updates).
Badgerbag's comments
the-red-shoes
Sinboy
coffeeandink
littlebutfierce
peaseblossom
ktempest
jfpbookworm
Feminist SF
James Nicoll
Cynthia1960
cynthia1960
springheel-jack
springheel-jack
springheel-jack
brown-betty
misia
petronelle
odditycollector
pleonastic
fengi
fengi
drownedinink
coffeeandink (Different post than linked above)
kate-nepevu
nihilistic-kid
upstart-crow
hahathor
cjouchan
cereta
nestra
scalzi
kadymae
vito-excalibur
jim-smith
cyberpilate
jarodrussell
kadymae
Getofftheinternet.org
vito-excaliibur
coffeeandink
troubleinchina
coffeeandink
brown-betty
Metafilter.com
awelkin
sparkymonster
sinboy
Girl-Wonder.org
The Iris Network
synedochic
--------------------
edited to add synedochic
--------------------
These include other people's reactions and points. If you look at the comments to those links, you'll find still more reactions. As you can see, a lot of feminists are scorching mad, and I can't blame them.
Here's my take. This is something embarked upon by consenting adults. Fine. Although contrary to the ferret's claim that no one was approached randomly in the halls, he himself writes of the woman in the princess outfit who they approached. The women who did this agreed to it, and John Scalzi writes that the woman who first told him about it was a participant and found it wonderful. I'm frankly envious that she is so free within her skin.
But.
I have spent most of my life in the fight to be perceived as a person, not a collection of body parts. "Biology is not destiny" is very important to me for a number of reasons. To read of women offering up their breasts to be fondled like fruit makes me crazy. That's my issue, obviously, not theirs, but it's something a lot of women and men will be thinking about when they observe this behavior, which is taking place in public. I want to ask these women, what message are you sending? You think you are sending the message, I am free in my body; I am proud of my body, but is that the message that people receive?
Most people won't know about the significance of red and green buttons; they will only see people groping other people, in public. Those who see this will be tense, wondering if they will be approached next. They will not feel safe in a space that the con organizers want them to feel safe in. Women who want to have fun and wear the costumes of their superheroes or anime characters will not feel safe. No matter how many times they tell themselves that clothing is not an advertisement for sexual contact, social brainwashing whispers "you're asking for it." They will choose either not to costume, or not to attend a con where they will not feel safe. Their enjoyment and their sense of safety will be destroyed. The con will be hurt when attendance drops, a serious thing when gas and flight prices make congoing more difficult.
Think on: this social experiment can go bad very quickly. All it takes is one woman who thought she'd try it and then feels violated, not liberated, or one man who decides that breast gropage means yes to further gropage. All it takes is outsiders who witness and report it to hotel management, or fans who don't know what's going on to blast what they've seen all over the internet as a SexCon. All it takes is one he said/she said, or worst of all, one rape. One misunderstanding, one person who thinks because the limits are lifted a little, it means they're lifted all the way.
Why was this not done behind closed doors? Why was it done publicly? I don't want to see other women making this kind of choice. To them it's freedom; to me it looks like they are allowing themselves to be treated as objects. Yes, in their own minds they are free, but do they know what is in the minds of those who fondle them, and those who see them fondled? By keeping it private, they have more control over those fondling them being the kind of person who perceives them as free and giving (maybe). But in public they lend themselves to others' perception of women as collections of parts to be handled. Even if they carried big, informative signs or gave PowerPoint demonstrations about their understanding of what they did, they cannot govern the views of others. They perpetuate a perception of women as sex toys, without even meaning to. I wish they had limited the damage.
I had a WONDERFUL time at Penguicon 6. How many people will remember that as the con of the two singing Tesla coils, and the comics artists drawing all over that guy's skull, and the Tron guy and the Ox delivering goodies from Acme? Or will they remember it as the con where guys were grabbing girls' tits?
- Location:home sweet home
- Mood:
irate - Music:"L'excessive," Carla Bruni